Re: [Bluemusic-users] [announce] blue 0.114.0
Brought to you by:
kunstmusik
From: Steven Y. <ste...@gm...> - 2007-02-28 01:37:53
|
Hi Michael, Thanks for your reply; I too use the looping feature in conjunction with tweaking quite a bit in my own work. I do see a value in adding that next level of live interaction in realtime could be quite useful though in mastering work, and would like to implement this kind of thing when time allows. I too envision blue more as a composing environment rather than a performance tool. I've experimented with performance work before and found that it isn't the experience where I find I am working with music in the best way for me. I don't think blue will every stray from its goal as compositional environment, but interestingly enough, if implementing realtime modification of parameters can happen, it might very well become a useful performance tool as a side effect. But if there's ever a case of going one way or another as a composing environment versus performance tool, I can guarantee it'll go to the side of composing environment first. As a note though, I have had some reservations of live editing of parameters in the past because it may incur a non-negliglble processing overhead that could affect the current compositional experience. Running csound as blue does now in its own process and with little communication has a number of benefits, particularly performance. So I think there will be a fair amount of testing involved to make sure it really is worth the effort. steven On 2/27/07, Michael Bechard <got...@ya...> wrote: > I agree. I've always thought of blue as a composition environment, not a performance tool. I understand the desire to tweak something while it's playing in realtime, just so you can know what changes to make in the composition afterwards, but blue already lends a big hand to the tweaking composer by using configurable start and end times and optional repeat; just play and repeat the section you're interested in and tweak as it loops. > > When it comes down to it, I'd much rather have two strong tools that do their respective jobs well (composing and performing), rather than one that tries to cram it all in at the expense of stable, simple(r) code. Perhaps what is needed is just a smoother interaction between performance-oriented csound tools and blue (I wouldn't know, though, since I have no experience with any performance-oriented frontends). > > Michael Bechard > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Cesare Marilungo <ce...@po...> > To: blue users mailing list <blu...@li...> > Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2007 12:37:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Bluemusic-users] [announce] blue 0.114.0 > > Steven Yi wrote: > > Hi Cesare, > > > > > >> I second Hector suggestion. During these days, while exploring Blue, > >> especially since I've discovered the BSB, I had the instinct of moving > >> the knob and the sliders in the BSB windows to tweak the sound in realtime. > >> > > > > This application of realtime is what I am interested in, to tweak > > while working. However... > > > > > >> Without too much change in the CSD file generation, and without the need > >> of digging in the csound api, you can implement this with OSC, simply > >> replacing the values of the krate variables filled with the gui controls > >> with variables that you read via OSC and setting them to the gui objects > >> value at the beginning of the playback. There should be ready made OSC > >> library for java, IIRC. To keep the compatibility with the non realtime > >> rendering you could sum the OSC values with the ones you get from the > >> BSB guis and consider the initial position of the widget = 0. > >> > > > > The big problem is now that we have parameter automation, no scheme > > like this can work. The only way I am aware of to accurately allow > > doing this is to use the API and sync on every kpass, using > > invalue/outvalue and getting the value from the line itself from blue. > > Doing this, this would also either require blue to compile csound > > projects and CSD by themselves would not be enough, or an optional > > mode to compile CSD's using the current system and to have a live CSD > > mode for when render within blue (which would be the option I would go > > for, as I want always to have the ability to render a standalone CSD). > > > I see... > but at least for me, I'm more interested in being able to listen how > changing the parameter affects the sound while playing back, not for > performing. I would use the parameter automation *afterward*, when > composing. For live performance it's more reasonable to use the OSC > opcodes with an external controller . > > Maybe it's not as simple as I tought. > > Also, can anyone tell me how other programs work when dealing with > > tweaking knobs when that knob has been automated? Is it allowed? > > Does it get recorded at incremental steps? > > > Well, in DAWs you have some states that you can select when > recording/playing back, like: OFF, Read, Write and Touch. But I don't > know if it would make sense to have this same behavior in Blue. > > In my opinion the strength of Blue is that it allows you to use csound > as it is meant to be used but with much more clean and organized > projects, code libraries and such. There's the risk of going too far > from the csound synthesis language paradigm to make it more like the > tools most musicians are used to. > > What do you think? > > c. > > I'm very interested to be able to do this myself and this is currently > > the big draw to use the API for me. I've got quite a full month ahead > > (presentations on blue in Ireland next week and in Berlin at LAC a > > couple of weeks after that) and I want to get JMask done sooner rather > > than later. There's also seems a big need to improve the lineEditor's > > to handle other table generation types, i.e. spline curves, segmented > > curves, etc. So... I guess it's a matter of prioritizing. Also, by > > May I will be moving back to California and will have to find a job to > > work once again, so once that happens blue development will likely > > slow somewhat. Hopefully all of these can be squeezed in before > > having to work again! =) > > > > steven > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT > > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your > > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash > > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV > > _______________________________________________ > > Bluemusic-users mailing list > > Blu...@li... > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bluemusic-users > > > > > > > > > -- > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV > _______________________________________________ > Bluemusic-users mailing list > Blu...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bluemusic-users > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Cheap talk? > Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. > http://voice.yahoo.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV > _______________________________________________ > Bluemusic-users mailing list > Blu...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bluemusic-users > |